But a common mistake that many kids make is by trying to be friends with the central figure in the group right off the bat. I think that's what ebeth's son is doing wrong. This approach rarely works. It gives the bully too much power and opens a kid up for ridicule.

Better to aim for befriending the peripheral kids in the group, the ones with less power and the ones more likely to be open to friendship. The more marginal the kids, the more open they are likely to be to friendship. Then, with luck and a little confidence, these friendships can open a door to friendship--or at least peaceful co-existence--with the group leader.

I love that so many people are throwing out ideas to help E-beth and her family. The more ideas the better.
Well, there's more than one way to skin a cat. I've always been more effective in solving a problem when I've been able to draw from a lot of info and cherry pick what would would work best for the given situation.

I am definately a high road person, after all people act like jerks all the time but the only one I have to look at everyday for the rest of my life, is me, in the mirror!
I'm a well adjusted, happy, intelligent, gregarious person with a lot to be grateful for, so I figure it's my responsibility to turn the other cheek when someone is making trouble and there are plenty of ways to stop that behavior if you have to without getting your hands dirty.
BUT,(and I have a very BIG BUT-humor alert-) there have been several occasions when someone has just kept coming at me no matter how many times I had gently manuevered around them. In fact, the more I was able to manuever around them, the more incenced they became until it became clear that it was just not going to let up. I mean at a point someone makes it clear that it's either them or you. Well as much as I hate to admit it, I value myself, so given that ultimatum, it's going to be them; everytime.

Maybe I will mellow out in my old age..........

I actually think Austin's advice is pure genius. But I'm concerned that a nine year old doesn't have the life experience to pull it off. Austin, could you really have come up with that when you were nine? I'm not trying to be antagonistic.
I seem to be someone that people sense should not be trifled with, but I'm 39 years old. There were many learning experiences along the way that got me to where I am. I sure wouldn't have been able to pull-off that level of sophisticated manipulation when I was nine, even if I had an instruction manual!

But let's keep throwing ideas out there for E-beth's DS. It's clear the bullying has to stop somehow.

And I love the counselor. I'm going to guess that she will be extremely helpful to DS in learning how to deal with bullying.

How hard is it? Does it have to be conscious?

I loved football/soccer when I was in school. I made lots of friends on the field that otherwise I would not have. These friends followed me back into the classrooms and playgrounds. At a new school, I always showed up for the pick-up games, got picked last, but proved myself. After a while I was 2d/3rd pick most of the time.

Same thing would occur at summer camps, scout camps, etc. The first two or three days would be rough as the bullies tried to use me as a whipping boy - probably because I would go off and read during non-programmed moments - I would plop down and read where ever I could. Then sports would start up and the need to win would arise and I'd be accepted.

What was I doing?

The trick is to find the common interests that join kids together. Videogames are big one today. Sports are another. Movies. You name it.

a GT kid can be motivated to analyze people and how they interact just as they would do for any subject. There are lots of books on Social Intelligence. Once a kid knows how to start up small talk, then he can interview the peer to see what they have in common.

Austin, I'm glad it was so easy for you.
You are not he.
Only he and his family know if this is something that would be as intuitive as it was for you.



Now this comment I am a little confused by. When you state "a gt kid" which one are you talking about. Same for, once "a kid"- who is this "a kid".

Is there just one kid with this ability?

It COULD be taken the wrong way as if the implication is "IF your kid is GT THEN they can be motivated to analyze people.
IF he can read a book THEN he can win friends and influence people.

I definately agree with your viewpoint but I don't think we can make the assumption that all gt kids could easily turn this social situation around, it's not logical to me.

I wouldn't want e-beth or anyone else to ever think that it's so simple they must just be doing something wrong or are inadequate for not being able to prevent it so simply. KWIM?

Austin has identified the main problem. My DS8 has nothing in common with these kids. The 11-year old likes violent video games (no, really?) which I won't let my son watch. The younger kids think he is cool because he can view things that are forbidden to them. So he can keep them hooked because he shares info with them that they can't get any other place. They are starting to talk about alcohol and how cool it is to be drunk. So if my son does play with them, he starts acting out what I would call inappropriate things with his lego figures.

We are really quite different from the average family around here, in that we don't let him watch a lot of tv and we don't have a game boy or WII. I have often worried that we are depriving him of some basic social connection, and would love to ask what other people think of this. We prefer to spend our time reading books and using your imagination. But in this world, that can isolate you by making you stand out as different. He got labeled as "weird" and "crazy" in second grade because the other kids were playing Pokemon on the playground. My DS loves collecting the cards and knows all about the characters. But he hasn't watched any of the tv shows. These kids wanted to act out the tv shows exactly, and whenever my son had an idea about something cool he could add using his imagination, then the game would stop and they would call him names and tell him to leave. Sigh.

Once DS(then 7) was up in a tree looping climbing rope through all the branches and having a ball when one of the next door kids came over (they are the same age). My son excitedly asked the other boy to come on up on his spaceship, and that he was about to blast off to another planet. The ropes were the electricity lines that he was plugging in to power his ship, and so he told the boy to be careful not to touch them when he was climbing up. The boy stood there looking confused. My son stopped and explained again that he was welcome to come up and play and that maybe they could go off and have a grand adventure exploring space and finding some evil jedi to conquer. The boy continued to stare. After about ten minutes, the neighbor boy finally said, "Oh, you are using your imagination!".

Needless to say, they are not the best match for playmates. They (twin boys) have been held back a year and my son has advanced a year. The parents on the block actually view my son as the weird one (because he is up in trees talking to himself about space adventures!) and would prefer to have their kids play with the 11-year old who acts out his first-person-shooter games in the front yard. They view DS8's vivid imagination (you know, the one you get from turning off the tube and reading books occasionally...) as a sign of a mental disability. They have actually told their kids that they don't trust DS8 and not to play with him.

How do you find kids that are similar to your kid when your kid is one in 10,000+? Does anyone else have trouble finding "normal" kids for their kids to play with?

As you all can probably tell by now, I am not a person of few words. (embarrassed grin!)

If I ever post a message of only a sentence of two, please someone.. check my pulse!

It seems like there are two issues. One is dealing/handling bullies. The second is finding appropriate friends.
Does that sound right?

Yes, that is quite correct.

(pulse check... yes I'm still here!)

What about applying to DYS?
I know others have mentioned MENSA for children's gatherings. We did take the girls to one in our area but there wasn't a ton going on.
I suspect a drama class might attract other kids who are comfortable using there imagination creatively. I'm just guessing but it sounds good......hey perhaps we should look into that!

For bullying: As mentioned I think it's always wise to recruit help from an expert like you have.
I will say I've made a concerted effort to balance between encouraging the girls to be themselves and aiding their ability to blend. It's a slippery slope, who knows if it's the right thing.
We did buy a Wii. Of course I thought it would be fun, but honestly a big part of the purchasing decision was made on the observation that the 5 and 7 year old girls who were visiting would NOT be pleased to play snap circuits. But, they all seemed to be happy when they play Wii. I only have a few non-offensive games like bowling and Mario Super Galaxy.
So I do, do little things like that to help them fit into the culture of our town/neighborhood. Right or wrong.

I'm glad your pulse is steady!

Ok, is this typical of most kids? I find this hard to believe. My boys engage in the type of play your son does on a minute basis. They would have had a blast climbing into that tree and pretending to conquer Darth Vador.

I feel profoundly sad for your son.