Have you given him the Meyers-Briggs personality inventory for kids? I mean, some of what you're describing sounds like a more extreme version of my whole household of INTJs. (With the exception of my 4yo extrovert, of course...) Here's the link, if it helps:

http://www.personalitypage.com/cgi-local/build_pqk.cgi



Well, frustration at not doing things perfectly and the best of all people in particular is VERY often true of HG+ kids. My DS7 has a very calm demeanor...most of the time. Then he loses at something and he throws a tantrum.

Also, I know that 7yos (and kids in that age range) can be *extremely* competitive in game situations, especially HG+ ones. Case in point: I taught a class on the Vikings/Norse to GT kids in 1-3rd grades, and we played a couple of games. Both times kids nearly came to blows over the games--different kids each time!--even though I was standing right there monitoring things! It was bad enough that I'm considering dropping games from my course completely the next time I teach it. (And BTW, I had an AS kid in the class, but he wasn't one of the kids involved in the conflicts.)

I know I sound like I'm saying your son isn't AS, and that's not really what I'm trying to do. I know almost nothing about AS! Just the little I've picked up here and there. But I guess I could see plenty of other explanations for the things you are describing.

I think your son's inappropriate emotional responses are the ones that most concern me. But as someone who is not AS and who often doesn't "get" the emotions of other people because of my particular personality profile (We INTJs on the Meyers-Briggs are Spock-like, if that tells you how clueless I tend to be about emotional stuff...), the other behavior is certainly problematic in terms of daily life, but it seems to my utterly uneducated-in-AS mind to be not all that abnormal. Just more extreme. But again, maybe we're bordering the spectrum and just don't know it...

One other thought: have you tried keeping a behavior journal for him? I've heard that sometimes you can spot triggers (lack of sleep, food allergies, sensitivities to food dyes or pesticides, etc.) that cause/contribute to troublesome behaviors, and I'm thinking that there may be something like that going on, maybe? (I'm also pretty clueless about this stuff, but it's another potential avenue to explore.)

But of course, feel free to disregard anything I say here! I am totally talking out of my area of expertise, such as that is...

I agree with Lorel. I have a friend who's son I am pretty sure has AS and she has had others mention it to her too but she is burying her head in the sand and is not even checking. So I think if you are concerned it would be worth checking out just for your peace of mind if nothing else. There are things that can be done for younger children to help them so it is good to catch at an early age if possible.

If you do decide to check it out, you can either be relieved that it isn't AS or you can start getting him help. Either way at least you'll know. And I applaud you for asking questions and not burying your head in the sand and for trying to figure out what is going on with your child.

Agreed. I should have said that before I wandered off into supposition land...

Thanks, EandCMom!

LOL Kriston!!! I totally missed your post when I posted. You presented some wonderful things to think about too!!!

Meh. Maybe. But I think the most important point is yours and Lorel's, and I meant to reiterate that first: get it checked out by an expert. I just got lost in my own thoughts!

Doh!

Yes, I agree, the anger response is, at least on paper, less concerning. He does respond in anger in appropriate situations. His anger is too much, but I have a temper too, and had an awful time as a child. (Even now I screw things up with my temper from time to time) That said, I think there is something qualitatively different about his anger response that it's very difficult for me to describe. Again though, that's lower on my concern list than some of the other things I've mentioned. (and other things I haven't mentioned because I didn't want to write a novella)

He looks awkward too, if he is standing in a circle of kids his posture and movement look different from the others. (He is also tiny, most people think he is 5 or 6, but he'll be 8 in August) I don't know that I've ever really noticed this before, but I was watching him very closely this week at fencing camp. He stunned me because on Friday, the last day of camp, he was willing to hold hands with other children in order to form a circle and he actually played a "duck duck goose" sort of game.

Regarding the food allergies, actually, my younger son has a number of food allergies and I took both boys to an allergist who specializes in food allergies and behaviors in Autistic children. My son was tested via the IGE blood test method. We found absolutely no food allergies, dyes and additives were on the list.

I definitely notice that he has trouble when he gets too hungry, but we've got a pretty good handle on that. The problem behaviors that concern me here are distinctive to when he is expected to be part of a group.

I'm going to go through the personality assessment now. Thanks for directing me to that.

Keep in mind too even professionals can have a tough time diagnosing some kids! I'm thinking in particular of a boy I taught in VBS (church camp). He was 8 at the time. He has since received an AS diagnosis, but I'm not sure I fully see it. (Keep in mind that I am NOT NOT NOT a professional!!!) The kid does have a "label" in there somewhere, whatever it might be, but I'm just not sure it's AS.

He also has a very high intelligence, which tends to complicate the equation.

The one thing I knew for sure, after getting to know that kid more, is that he is a really neat kid, with tons of strong traits that will help counter his more difficult areas. VBS was not easy on him, but I'll never forget when he saw me a good 6 months later, and his true excitement to see me! My first thought at that time was "there is more to this kid than a rubber stamp label!"

I do hope you get some level of answers, to help you know how to proceed, but just don't get too hung up on any one summary that is not specifically YOUR child.

And welcome!

He got an ISJ on the inventory. There a couple of things that don't fit at all, like:

"They enjoy participating in group sports or team activities"

Otherwise, it looks like a reasonably good fit, but I really wavered on a lot of the questions.

This one:
When meeting new people, is the child more likely to
•be shy until they get to know them
•be friendly and unafraid, and enjoy meeting the strangers
•observe from the sidelines for a short while, and then be friendly and unafraid
Don't know

That was really tough because the real answer would be that he's very open and will be friendly and talkative to an adult, but he totally hangs back and is reluctant to talk to other kids unless they come to him first, then he's friendly, just odd.

The times that he hangs back and observes from the sidelines are when he's supposed to be part of a group. Like, he's happy if he has one or two people to talk to, but any more than that and he's lost.

I don't know, I'm not sure that really got me any closer to an answer because I don't know that I could really feel confident about any of my responses. I kept wanting to add caveats.

I'm wondering if his expressive reading is more related to his imitative skills than to empathy.

Also, I'd like to recommend The Mislabeled Child by the Drs. Eide. It has a very good chapter on how to distinguish Asperger's characteristics from other things.

Yes, Dottie. I also have a friend with a GT child (probably HG, though I don't know for sure) who is homeschooled because the school was pushing for a diagnosis of some sort--and AS was tops on their list!--but he just didn't fit that label. They wouldn't let the child in the GT program until the behavior was figured out, though clearly lack of challenge was a big part of the problem.

Sleep issues are another big part of the boy's problem. His behavior looked very AS on Thursday and Friday, when the wear-and-tear of the week had him worn out. But a kid can't be AS only two or three days of the week.

And did I mention that his dad is a psychologist specializing in the autism spectrum? So, yeah, they we about as aware of the situation and the potential diagnoses as anyone could be!

The mom's take, after repeated testing AND medical poking and prodding AND sleep studies AND psychologist's visits AND psychiatrist's visits AND drugs AND so on AND so on...:"Something's up with him, but it's not anything that has a label. The school needed a label. That's why we're not in the school anymore."